Do I Want to Work with My Family?

Introduction:

Last September, we hosted a 21 Hats Brainstorm podcast episode in which BaLeigh Waldrop told us that she was considering buying the family business from her parents. BaLeigh, who has been serving as chief financial officer of the Miller Waldrop furniture business that her great grandfather started, recognized that she was being offered a remarkable opportunity, but she had some concerns. Sales have been off of late, the business is predominantly brick-and-mortar, and most importantly, she would have to work out an ownership structure with her younger brother. The 21 Hats crew of owners and entrepreneurs who joined the brainstorm asked a lot of good questions and offered smart suggestions. “I think what’s actually incredibly hard about this whole thing is that I love it,” says BaLeigh. “I love wearing the different hats. I love owning a business in a small community.” We left it that BaLeigh would get back to us once she’d figured things out. In this week’s episode, she returns to tell Jay Goltz and the rest of us what she’s decided.

— Loren Feldman

Guests:

BaLeigh Waldrop is CFO of Miller Waldrop Furniture & Decor.

Jay Goltz is CEO of The Goltz Group.

Producer:

Jess Thoubboron is founder of Blank Word.

Full Episode Transcript:

Loren Feldman:
Welcome Jay, and welcome back to our special guest, BaLeigh Waldrop. BaiLeigh, we recorded a podcast [episode] with you back in September, I believe, in which we gathered a group of owners and entrepreneurs to try to help you think through whether you wanted to take over the family furniture business. Before you tell us what you’ve decided, could you take us back and kind of set the scene? Remind us what the business is and what you were thinking at the time.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Sure, I’d love to. So my family has a retail furniture store. My great grandpa started it in 1952, and then he handed it down to my grandpa, who handed it down to my dad. And now my dad and me and my brother and my mom all work at the furniture store, and so the big question of, really, my life, having been born into the furniture dynasty—I guess we can call it—is whether or not I’m going to take it over and what role as a family member do I play in the business.

So a little bit more about the business, just briefly: It’s in southeastern New Mexico and West Texas. It has lived many different lives in different locations since 1952 but the current locations are in a mountain town in Ruidoso, New Mexico, and Hobbs, New Mexico, which is the flagship location. Hobbs is a small oil and gas town. And then, in Lubbock, Texas, which is West Texas, is the third location. So, all furniture retail. There’s also some mattresses in there. Right now, as we may get into later, the economy is not too great for furniture, for retail furniture. So our sales are about $10 million, about 40 employees. But that’s fluctuated a lot as the economy has fluctuated.

Jay Goltz:
So wait, it’s 10 now. What was it?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Well, it’s kind of hard to say, because we expanded during the pandemic, which is a whole other conversation for another time. But when we were at our height, we were at about $15 million, and we had about 60 employees.

Loren Feldman:
And what has your role at the business been?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
So, as a family member—a nod to the name of this podcast—you wear lots of different hats.

Loren Feldman:
Thank you.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
But my main role was being the CFO. My background is in accounting and finance. I’m a CPA. So that was an easy role for me to step into. So that’s the primary hat I wore in the business, but as a family member, you do a little bit of everything.

Loren Feldman:
And take us back to when we had that conversation in the fall. What were you thinking at the time? I guess what I’m asking is, why wasn’t this just something you wanted to do? What was going through your mind that made you hesitant about taking over the business?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, so I think back when we did the podcast, there were several things that we talked about—everyone should go listen. But I think the main thing for me was trying to figure out family dynamics. The structure for our business has always been that one child took it over and the other child didn’t want anything to do with the business.

So we didn’t really have a good blueprint for two children being interested in the business, which is me and my brother. We’re the only ones. We don’t have any siblings, so trying to figure that out, what that would look like felt like a mystery, really, to all of us. We weren’t sure how to navigate that. So I think there were lots of things playing into that. That was the main question that I was sitting with whenever we had our panel back in September.

Loren Feldman:
And how were your parents handling it at that point? Were they hopeful? Were they exerting any pressure? How would you characterize their thinking?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, my parents have always been really great. They have said my whole life, “Go, do what you want to do. There’s nothing holding you here. We’d love to have you, but please, go do what you want to do.” And I think this is something great that they’ve done—and I think any family business should implement this practice—they required us to go get some professional experience after college, before they’d even let us work at the business. So I think they really handled all of that well.

Now that I’ve been in the business since 2018, I think they are—it’s hard for them, because I play a major role now, and they’ve gotten used to having me around. But I think ultimately, they know that this is the rest of my life, and they want our family to be okay at the end of this. And they want me to thrive and be healthy and be okay as well. So even though I know they have a lot of feelings about it personally, and they have an economic future that they’re concerned about as well, I think they’ve handled it really well as parents.

Loren Feldman:
All right, BaLeigh, so what did you decide?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
What did I decide? Well, I have decided not to take over the business, and I am slowly phasing out of my roles. Hopefully, I will be completely out by the end of the year.

Loren Feldman:
Wow, was it a tough decision for you?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Oh, yeah, very tough. You know, I think back to the podcast [episode], actually, that we did, and I don’t remember who said it, but someone said, “Why haven’t you done it?” And at the time, I thought that was kind of a silly question. “Well,” I was like, “that’s why I’m here. I’m trying to figure that out.”

But I think that it hit something home, because if you have something you really want to do, you just go do it. And I think there was something that I couldn’t quite figure out what was holding me back, right? And I think that was part of the journey of the podcast, and my personal journey in September. And what I came to was that I want my family to be my family. I do not want them to be business partners. And it’s really as simple as that. There’s some really good things about working with my family. There’s some really hard things about working with my family. But at the end of the day, I don’t want to be in business with them.

Jay Goltz:
Okay, I get the family dynamics part, but I question: How much of it is that there’s 21 hats to wear, and you really like the accounting hat, and maybe you don’t mind a couple of the others, but there’s a few of them you really don’t like at all. Which means: What if this wasn’t your family? What if you just worked at this company, and the owner said, “Hey, do you want to take this over?” Would that have been any different? Is it really that you don’t want to work with your family? Or is it really that you don’t want to be a business owner? They’re two different things, or both?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, I think that’s a great question. And I think what’s actually incredibly hard about this whole thing is that I love it. I love wearing the different hats. I love owning a business in a small community. There’s parts of the family legacy that I think are interesting too. I’ve actually—since I’ve decided not to be a part of the family business, I’ve talked to two different brokers about different business deals that me and my husband almost did. So it’s—I love this world. I love the entrepreneurial side of it. I love the hats. I actually—whatever I do next, I don’t think I’m going to do anything traditional, CPA accounting. I can do it, but it’s not where my heart is.

So, yeah, it’s hard because, in a family business, in a way, you have this silver platter that is handed to you. You know, you have the family legacy. Our business has been successful. I do think my parents have done a wonderful job with it. So you’re handed all this really nicely, right? But for me, it’s coming to: Okay, I can’t reconcile the two. At the end of the day, I can’t be business partners with my family and still live a healthy, thriving life. And so it’s hard. It’s really hard, but I am at peace with it. And I know that this is totally the right decision for me and my family. And I think we’ll look back in 5, 10, 15, 20, 25, 30-so on years, and know, for all of us, that this was a good choice.

Jay Goltz:
You keep calling it a family business, but the fact is, your parents are going to be out of it at some point. What would happen—and I don’t know if you can answer this—your visceral reaction: Your brother wakes up one day and goes, “You know what, I really want to sell cars. I don’t like the furniture business. I’m out of here.” And your parents are retiring. Do you have a problem taking it over then?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Maybe not. Maybe not.

Jay Goltz:
Interesting.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, I’ve had that same thought. You know, my thought was a little bit more morbid. [Laughter] Like, what would happen if they all go away?

Jay Goltz:
No, I’m of that age. I think about it all the time. I realize I am going to die one day. There’s no getting around that, and so are your parents. And so, I’m just wondering, is this a temporary thing that’s going to—forget about dying. They’re going to retire at some point. So the question is: How does your brother feel about this whole thing, about you leaving?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, I think that he is sad. I think he enjoyed working with me and was excited about a potential partnership with us. But I do think there’s probably a part of him that is happy that he has the whole pie to himself. I mean, he can’t help but not think that, and that’s okay. You know, that’s fine.

Loren Feldman:
Is this also an ownership decision? I mean, does this mean you won’t own any percentage of the business as well?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Right now, that’s what that means, yeah. So we hired a professional business coach to come in that specializes in family succession. And a lot of the conversations we were having are, you know, is there a way that we can slice the pie where ownership and leadership is structured in the right way, where everyone gets what they need, and everyone’s playing the role in the best way that they know how and that they can add to the business?

And as I thought through that, every single path I went down, it just ended in the fact that it still put me in a business partnership with my brother. Because when you’re an owner, you get the profits, but you’re also on the hook for a loss. And that’s just not the relationship I want to have with my brother or my family.

Jay Goltz:
So is your—and obviously, you don’t have to answer this if you don’t want—but is your brother buying the business from your parents?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
I think he’s hoping to, yeah.

Jay Goltz:
Right. Because, if that’s the case, then you’re going to get half of the inheritance. So you are ultimately getting half the business, if that’s how it works out. Usually the sibling who takes it over buys the business and pays off the other siblings. So I would think, ultimately, that’s what’s going to happen.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, the structure with us would be that my brother would start to pay off my parents. It would be seller-financed, owner-financed, and so if he was able to pay them back completely before they’re gone, then it’s his, the part that he bought. I think they’re gonna structure it in a way that they’ll still hold on to some of the real estate, so he’s just buying the business. So there’ll be some real estate left over. But you know, it all just depends how everything ends up at the end of the day. But I personally made my peace that maybe I don’t see any of it, and that’s okay. That’s the decision I’m making in deciding to step away and not be a part of it.

Jay Goltz:
And how do your parents feel about this?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
It would be interesting if we had them on. I think that they’re sad. I think they’re sad, for sure. You know, we talked about this a little bit in the first podcast [episode], but my brother is still young, and he’s still green, and so—

Jay Goltz:
Wait. How young?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
I always make him younger than he is, but I’m pretty sure he’s 26.

Jay Goltz:
Okay, that’s young.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
I’m also young, but I have had more professional experience than he has. And with me comes a husband who’s older than me, who has way, way more experience than me, too. And so I think at this point, it’s fair to say that me and my husband could take over the business tomorrow, and it could run. I mean, I’m willing to admit that I still have plenty to learn. I don’t think that I would be perfect. I think there would still be more to go. But my brother is not in a place where he could take it over tomorrow, so there is on their side a little bit of, “Oh man, we’re still in this.”

Jay Goltz:
I am your parents. I’ve told my kids, “I don’t want to hang this business on anybody. Do whatever you want.” And that all sounds great until you find out they don’t want it. And then you think: I’m in the suck part of succession right now. It sucks because I’ve got nobody to take it over, and I’m trying to figure out how to navigate that. So I’m sure they meant it when they said that, but that doesn’t mean that—you know, they have to figure this out, obviously.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Right, right.

Loren Feldman:
How did you tell them, BaLeigh? Was it a big deal?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, it was. We had dinner, and I gave them a hug, and I said, “I’m about to tell you something that’s going to be hard.” And I told them, “You know, that I’ve been on this journey of trying to figure this out, and I’ve taken the journey very seriously. And I’ve just come to the conclusion that I can’t be in business with my family and be the healthy version of myself that I want to be. And I have a ton of clarity about this, and I love you guys so much, but it’s because I love you that I need to step away. And I’m preserving our relationship by doing that, by just leaving it to us being a family relationship and not a business relationship.”

So it was hard. I had a mentor throughout this process, and I won’t name him, but he came from a fairly large, well-known family business, and they sold it, and it’s rumored to be that it was a contentious family situation. I don’t know all the facts, but that’s the rumor on the street about how it went down. And I asked him, I said, “You know, when you drive by these stores, how do you feel? Are you sad? Do you look at it and think, ‘Wow, my family started that. It’s not in our family anymore.’” And he said, “You know, I am sad, but I think about my kids, and I think about the fact that they may get to have a relationship with their cousins that I never got to have. That, right there, is worth it.”

Jay Goltz:
No, having the cousin thing, it’s a real problem. You were fortunate. You got down to your generation without having it—because it gets ugly.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, you know what’s interesting is—and I have been meaning to bring this up with my parents, but—our whole lives, they said the reason our family business has made it is because only one sibling was interested in the business and took it over. They said that our whole lives. So, you know, I think it’s funny. I try to tell my dad all the time. I’m like, “Dad,”—and we all have great relationships with each other, but I’m like—”would you have wanted to be in a business with your sister?” And he’s like, “Oh no.” Not that I don’t love my brother, I think he’s great. But family businesses are hard.

Jay Goltz:
No, I can tell you from personal observation of extremely well-known Chicago businesses: ugly as can be. It can be very, very bad, not just a little bad. I always say: Family businesses are either great or horrendous, not a whole lot in between. Really, just not a whole lot. So I applaud your bravery in doing what you think is the smartest thing for yourself.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Thanks, Jay.

Loren Feldman:
You know, BaLeigh, I think part of this is just the idea of having a partner. A lot of business owners walk away from a job or some other alternative way of making a living and choose to be a business owner because they don’t want to have a boss and they don’t want to answer to anybody else like a partner. Jay happens to be one of those business owners.

In this case, what you were facing was having a partner who was also a family member, which it sounds like, that made it more fraught. You’re talking about possibly going into business in some other way. With your husband is one thing, I suppose. But would you want a partner in that kind of business? Or is that part of the issue here, too?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
I think it’s part of it, for sure. It’s so funny, these stories that you’re told as you’re growing up, and how they stick with you. But I had a business law professor, and he started every single class saying, “Do not get in a business partnership”—so much so that he’d say it and we’d have to finish the sentence, because it was his thing—because he had done so much litigation involving business partnerships and seeing them blow up. And you know, I think it’s a very special, unique relationship for you to be able to be business partners with someone.

Jay Goltz:
You know what, that’s an occupational hazard of being a lawyer. There are plenty of good partnerships. I’m not arguing with him, though. I would say probably more bad than good. But there are some. That’s just a stupid comment. There are some extremely successful partnerships where one does the front, one does the back. So to blanket it all with, “I’ve seen too many lawsuits,” that certainly is a reason to be extremely careful, and I wouldn’t recommend a partnership, but I would certainly never say never get a partner.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, I think that’s fair, Jay. I think, speaking in absolutes is always, like, “Let’s question that for a second.” But I think for me, personally, it would take a unique, special person for me to be willing to go into business with them.

Jay Goltz:
Here’s the most haunting conversation I’ve had with someone. I was in YPO many, many years ago. I’m talking to a guy about my age, 30-something at the time, he has two kids, I don’t know, eight and five. And he owned—with his brother and his father—a chain of small stores, like six of them or something. And he decided he didn’t think the future was bright for it, and he wanted out.

So he wanted them to buy him out, and they wouldn’t give him any money. So he takes them to court. So I look at him and I say, “Wow, your mother must be at the end of her rope, distraught.” And he looked me in the eyes, and he said, “My mother thinks I’m a worthless piece of shit and never wants to talk to me again.” And I just thought, “Oh my god, the mother gave up her grandchildren, her son.”

Loren Feldman:
How did you tell your brother?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
I told him, kind of just the same as my parents. We went to dinner, and I said, “Hey, I have some hard news.” And I told him, “I love you, and I care about you.” And I affirmed some good things that I see in him, in the business. And I just said, “For me, I just need to only be in a family relationship with you guys and not be in a business one.”

But you know, this isn’t a new conversation for me and my brother. We’ve been talking about this since he came into the business. We’ve been having very open conversations about things that bother us about each other. We were very big on having a one-way street, and trying to not talk around each other but to each other. And I do think that we did that well. And a lot of that is to his credit. He’s kind of a cut-through-the-BS, let’s just talk about it kind of person. And so we’ve been talking about it for a while. So I don’t think he was surprised. But, still hard.

Jay Goltz:
You answered the question before I asked it, which was going to be, there’s some issues there that are bothersome, and I was hoping you did try to fix it. So you’re saying, it sounds like you did. I mean, you gave it a good shot and concluded that this is not resolvable enough to where you’d be comfortable. So, I’m glad you tried.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, I’m really glad we did, too. And I think that we’re all stronger for it. I think it’s really hard sometimes to just be real and talk about it, especially as you’re learning how to have that type of relationship with your brother or parents or whoever it is. But yeah, I don’t think I’d even call it issues necessarily. You know, I’m his sister, and he’s my brother, and we go back to those roles that we grew up in, and also we just had some different ideas about how we’d do it. Neither bad or good, just different.

Jay Goltz:
I have to tell you, I’m a little surprised. I thought that this conversation was going to be, “You know what, I really love accounting, and I decided I really want to do accounting because the management stuff I don’t love.” I didn’t think it was going to be that you just decided you didn’t want to be in business with family. But that’s interesting.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
I was thinking about, before we got on this podcast, I thought, “Well, this is basically just going to be a therapy session,” and that’s the interesting thing about family businesses, right? It’s like, how do you find the balance between the personal and the family relationship and the professional side of it? Which I think is, anyone that’s in a family business, they’re trying to navigate that.

Loren Feldman:
So it’s a therapy session for both you and Jay, because you’re on both sides of it.

Jay Goltz:
Yeah, it’s been a really eye-opening thing for me for the last year of just figuring it out, and I probably said it before, for the sake of those that didn’t hear it, the three things I’ve learned. One is, you don’t understand the damage having your kid in the business, if they don’t fit there or whatever, you don’t really understand what that’s going to do to your business.

Two, there’s a genetic piece of this. I believe that there are certain parts of owning a business that there’s a genetic makeup for. And just like you couldn’t teach me to climb mountains, or you couldn’t teach me to do a lot of things, there’s certain aspects of this, of being a business owner, that just are innate and are genetic.

And thirdly, you’re not doing your kid any favor to try to squeeze a square peg into a round hole. And hence—and I think this is pretty accurate—they say only 20 percent of businesses get to the next generation. And I can understand why now.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
I haven’t heard that stat before, Jay. That’s interesting.

Jay Goltz:
I’ve heard it from lots of people.

Loren Feldman:
Well, your business is the exception, clearly, BaLeigh, multiple generations.

Jay Goltz:
So I have a friend who I’ve known for years. He’s in the frame business, and he sends his youngest kid here to take a tour and tell him what I think, blah, blah, blah. And the kid’s really into it and sharp and great. And I call him. I go, “Bill, you pulled something off that I couldn’t pull off. You got a kid taking over the business.” And we realized, that’s because he had four kids and I only had three. [Laughter] It’s the odds. You’ve got to have four. For the 20 percent to work, you need the four.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
That’s so funny. Jay, I’m curious. I think when you have that parent-child relationship, it can go—well, it can go many ways, but I think one of the two ways that normally goes is either the parent is super hard on the kid, or they have all these blind spots, and they don’t see what the kid’s doing, and they can’t evaluate them fairly. What do you think? Do you think you fall into one of those two camps?

Jay Goltz:
My oldest one is in real estate, does well. He’s doing his thing. And my other two: One is here, and he does all the computer stuff. And he’s very good at it and gets along with everyone well. And he has made it clear he doesn’t want to take the business over. His wife’s an eye doctor. He’s made it clear from day one. He doesn’t want to take the business over.

And the youngest one, he’s just not suited to own the business. There’s stuff that I relish about this business, whether it’s the people or the buildings I bought, and it doesn’t mean anything to him. And, none of my three kids could frame a picture. They couldn’t go to the saw and cut something. My business is in the city. My kids grew up in the suburbs. They didn’t work here during spring break, they didn’t work. So I realized: This is my thing. And, um—

Loren Feldman:
Jay, you’re not coming close to answering BaLeigh’s question. [Laughter]

Jay Goltz:
Which was what? No, I think I’m clear-eyed. I am answering it. I do think I know. I am watching, and I think I am clear-eyed and not too hard. I think that it’s obvious that this isn’t the right fit.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
How do you remain clear-eyed? Like, do you bring other staff into it? Do you ask them what they think?

Jay Goltz:
Oh, the staff brought themselves into it. That’s part of one of the issues. It didn’t go well, and it is what it is. And it took me a while to finally—like I said, I think he will be happy doing something else.

Loren Feldman:
So maybe you did have some blind spots. Maybe there were things the staff saw that you didn’t see? There’s no shame in that.

Jay Goltz:
No, no, I’m sure that I didn’t understand. That’s why I say, those three things I came up with? It took me a while to figure that out. I really didn’t understand that. I mean, you’ve got to remember, I’ve got people here for 20-30, years. They put him through college. Some of them were here when he was born. I mean, it’s complicated.

Here’s one—this word is overused, but in this case, it’s true: It’s complicated. That’s for sure. It’s complicated. And I’m sure that I didn’t understand it full enough going into it and didn’t think about it enough, for sure. With that being said, no damage done. I tried. He tried, I tried. And my middle one, he doesn’t want to take over the business. Now, I don’t mean this as a joke, and it will sound like a joke but I mean it sincerely: I’m hoping, if I stay healthy, I’m hoping to be coming to work in 15 years. In 15 years, my 13-year-old grandson will be 28. Maybe he’s taking it over. I knew you’d laugh, but it’s true. It does happen. He’ll be 28 years old.

Loren Feldman:
That’s the fourth kid.

Jay Goltz:
Yeah, I don’t know that that won’t happen. And I’ve also got some 30-some-year-olds who work for me, who I’m putting a lot of energy into. I think maybe one of them can run it.

Loren Feldman:
In the last podcast [episode], Jay, you offered to adopt BaLeigh if she would come and take over the business. Does that offer still stand?

Jay Goltz:
Absolutely. [Laughter] We’ve got deep-dish pizza here. It’s not as cold as they say it is here.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
I don’t know. I’ve been watching ER reruns. It seems like there’s a lot of rain.

Jay Goltz:
No, that’s just a dramatic effect. Absolutely not.

Loren Feldman:
BaLeigh, obviously, it wasn’t the main reason, but I’m curious: To any extent, were you concerned about the sustainability of the industry, of retail in general, furniture in particular?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, that’s a good question. It’s hard to dissect everything, because nothing’s ever black and white, right? I remain optimistic about the furniture retail space. I think that family-owned businesses are the backbone of brick-and-mortar retail furniture. And we were part of lots of different trade groups, and we go to lots of different conferences, and we’re just a copy-and-paste of a furniture retailer in every single city and area of the country that have been in it since even before the 1950s. And they’re third-, fourth-, fifth-generation, and they’re going strong. Because I think something that’s interesting about furniture retail is you can’t go sit on a couch that you get delivered to you at your door that you bought online. And if you want to return it, there’s some people that do it okay, but it’s a lot harder to return a couch than it is a sweater you didn’t like.

So I think that, like every industry, the furniture retail industry definitely needs to pivot to figure out how to thrive in this landscape and the ever-changing ways that things look. And I think the challenge for retailers that are family-owned—and I was talking to Jay about this offline earlier— but the way that we advertised in the ’50s, the ’60s, the ’70s, the ’80s, the ’90s, early ‘00s, it didn’t really change that much.

But the game has changed so much with the internet and digital advertising and not having print. And I think the retailers that are willing to adapt with this landscape, I think they’re going to figure it out. I think if I’m honest with myself, do I have a lot of energy towards figuring that out in this specific space, with my family, in this furniture store that I’ve grown up with my whole life in the small town where people tell me they saw me in commercials when I was a baby? No, I don’t. I don’t have a lot of energy towards it, but I do think that there’s a space for furniture retailers. They just have to figure out how they’re going to stay surviving in it.

Jay Goltz:
I will tell you, because I’m in the furniture business, there’s no guessing here. Half as many people are moving today as were three, four, or five years ago. If 40 percent of the furniture bought in America is bought because people move, well, there’s the 20 percent. So it’s not making up excuses. There’s no question. The furniture industry is down 20-30 percent because of the high interest rates. At some point, even if interest rates don’t go down, people are going to have to start moving again. They’re downsizing, they’re having babies, they’re losing jobs. I mean, they’re gonna have to start moving. I do think the furniture industry will come back. So we are dealing with that at the moment.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, for sure. And I think, like anything, there’s winners and losers when the economy does what it does, and there’s already a lot of players that have left the market in this time, and so things readjust. And something about my family’s business is we have made it through a lot, so I think that there’s a lot of resiliency built up in how we’ve done it. And, you know, that’s lessons learned for me, for whatever I do next.

Loren Feldman:
And how are you approaching that? How are you thinking about what you might do next?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, if anyone has any answers… Maybe we need to have another panelist who can help me figure it out.

Jay Goltz:
She’s going to open another furniture store to compete with her brother.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, I’m just going to throw the whole family ties, worried about relationships, and just throw it out the window and open up competition across the street. You know, I’m being really thoughtful about it, and I’m taking it slow. I’m in the time of my life where I’m having babies. And so, I’m trying to tell myself—my husband says this all the time. He’s like, “Life feels really short, but it also can feel really long.”

And so I think that I’m in a unique season right now where I want to get my kids to kindergarten, and I want to focus on them, and I don’t want to rush into anything. So I’m trying to just do a lot of self-reflection of: What is it that I’m good at? What do I enjoy? What do I want my life to look like? I don’t know if either of you are familiar with Brene Brown?

Loren Feldman:
Not deeply, but I know who you’re talking about.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
I’m probably her target demographic, but she talked about, her and her husband kind of looked at their life, and they had had all these priorities of what they wanted their life to look like, that they had written down. And then they looked at all the decisions they’d made in the last two years, and all of them were in direct opposition to what they wanted their life to look like. So I’m trying to take that seriously and really think about: Okay, well, I have the opportunity to start from scratch here. What do I want my life to look like? And so I’m just sitting in that and I’m taking some breaths.

Jay Goltz:
I would encourage you to take some tests. They’re unbelievably accurate from what I’ve seen. Like, I took a DISC test not long ago. It was really eye-opening. It tells you your personality type, and it was really insightful and gave me food for thought. And luckily, it didn’t tell me, “Oh, that’s why you shouldn’t be in business.” DISC is—I forgot what it stands for. Driven. Yeah, D was driven. So I got a 92 there, and then they kept going down as they went along. It would be good to test yourself.

And then the second thing I would say is: Don’t mix up business ownership with entrepreneurship. They’re not the same thing. You walked into a business that was around for generations and didn’t have to worry about making payroll and growing and, “Did we pick the right location?” You start from scratch. That’s what the word entrepreneur means in French, taking a risk.

That’s a whole other animal, which is why I gotta tell you, buying a business might be the smartest thing. You see what you’re getting. You can do the math on it and not suffer through the pains of a startup. And there’s plenty, they say. There’s a gray tsunami now. All of the Baby Boomers are getting older and are going to have to do something with their business, unless their kids take it over. So you’re kind of taking advantage of the 80 percent who don’t have somebody to take it over in the family.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, that’s great advice, Jay. I was gonna see if you could let me guess your DISC. I think you told us you’re a D. I was gonna guess that you’re a DI.

Jay Goltz:
Well, no, I am. And the “I” was pretty high, but then the last two really, really tanked. I forgot. Do you know what the other ones stand for?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Steady and conscientious.

Jay Goltz:
Yeah, right. Got much lower there. [Laughter]

Loren Feldman:
BaLeigh, when you fantasize about what you might do next, do you see yourself owning a business, and do you see a particular type of business?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, I think this is a fun question. The thing that I love about owning a business is the employees and getting to make a difference in their life. And Jay actually talked about this earlier, about how some of his employees saw their kids grow up. And I think the second hardest thing about this decision, to leave the business, is leaving my family, yes, but leaving back some of those employees who feel like family to me, because they have been in it since I was a junior hire who was probably full of attitude. And, you know, they still have been so kind to me throughout this process of growing up in the business.

And so I think that I love the idea of having employees and being able to make work a place where they enjoy it, and they thrive, and they can go home and say they enjoy what they’re doing. And I think that’s what I enjoy the most. I enjoy creating systems. I enjoy building things. I enjoy working with people. I enjoy being in the community. So I think that there’s lots of different businesses that could check my boxes.

Jay Goltz:
I’m thrilled to hear that you’ve figured that out, because I didn’t think of it for many years. You know, I always say: It’s not the income that matters; it’s the outcome. And I feel great that I’ve had a profound impact on a whole lot of people. And every day I go to work, part of the reason I go to work is, I feel great that I’m giving people jobs and treating them well. And I’m glad you said that, because that shows you’re not just like, “Oh, I love accounting,” because nothing wrong with just loving accounting, but what you said is far more relevant to someone who owns a business than just doing the accounting piece. So you sound like a good business owner. All right, we’ve got to find you a business to buy.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, yeah. Help me out!

Loren Feldman:
Well, just in case somebody listens to this who has a business, who thinks you might be appropriate for it, give us an example of the type of business that would allow you to enjoy all the things you just described.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, I mean, I think there’s so many businesses that fit that bill, like any business that has already, hopefully, established that culture a little bit and cares about the community, and cares about their people, and wants to leave the business, but they’re worried about leaving behind their employees, and wants to know that they’ll be taken care of. That’s what I care about the most.

I do love retail. I think retail is really fun. I think it’s hard, but it’s fun. And I think there’s so many different ways businesses are evolving now. So they’re not just your brick and mortar. My husband’s a data scientist. He offers tons of that type of service on the side, and he’s starting up a business, so we’re enjoying doing that.

Jay Goltz:
The interesting part of that is, yes, you could buy a company that’s a great corporate culture, or you could buy a company that has some great fundamentals but that doesn’t have a great corporate culture—that if the person ran it better, they’d be far more successful. I have seen that, where people take over other businesses and make them way better than they were because they’re better managers. So it might be the opposite. Maybe you’re better off looking for a dysfunctional company that needs somebody to come in and run it better.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, maybe.

Jay Goltz:
Much better price.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, that’s a whole other conversation, too. You know, when culture’s bad, I think it’s sometimes really hard to turn it around. But it’s a fun idea.

Jay Goltz:
It usually requires changing a couple of people, and all of a sudden—the culture, obviously, is the people. So if there’s only six people there—I’ve seen this—all it would take is one to mess up the whole corporate culture. You know that old adage, “One bad apple can spoil the whole bunch”? There’s some truth to that. I’ve seen it.

So who knows? Just identifying somebody who is not the right culture could make a huge impact on the business. And I’ve seen business owners who just ignore it and think that, “Oh no, they’re so important, I have to put up with it.” And I’ve seen them just almost ruin the business.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I’ve seen that. We’ve seen that in the furniture business, and even in our stores, right? We have four different locations, or, well, eight different physical buildings where people work, and sometimes you’ve just got to get rid of one and it turns around.

Jay Goltz:
Wait, you have eight stores?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Well, we have four different retail locations, but we have eight buildings where people physically work. You know, like the warehouses, we have an admin center. So each of those is kind of their own little culture within the big culture. And it’s interesting how a sour apple can get in there, and it starts to spread in that location, and then it moves. And then we realize that’s the source, and it’s gone within a month.

Loren Feldman:
BaLeigh, did we miss anything?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Oh man, I think the only other thought I have about all this is, it has been incredibly hard and bittersweet to walk away. And there are definitely days I’m like, “Why am I doing this?” But the analogy that I’ve been holding onto is kind of the idea of building your dream house. So, it’s a lot easier to go and pick one off the market and it’s a little cheaper that way, and it probably has like 80 percent of what you want. But there’s also opportunity, and it takes some time. It’s a little bit more expensive to build a custom home, just like you like it. And my philosophy is always: We get one life. And even though I think that if I chose to take over the business, I think it still would have been great. I think it would have been 80 percent there. And I’m grateful that I’m in the position that I can say no and hope for something that’s a little bit closer to what I need for my life.

And so I’m trying not to have a scarcity mindset in all of this and know that I still have my whole life in front of me and still many doors to open and close. And even though this one was a really hard one to close, I’m hopeful that two things will happen. One, I think this will be good for my family in the long-term—like my immediate family, but also my parents and my brother. I’m hoping I’m making a decision that sets up our family for success. But two, I do think it’s setting me up for whatever it is that comes next, even if I never own a business, that it’ll be a better fit for me.

Jay Goltz:
Here’s a new thought you probably haven’t thought of: This doesn’t necessarily mean it’s permanent. Things change. Life changes. Who knows? Maybe in four years your brother will evolve and grow up more, and your parents change, or you change. Who knows? Just you never know, maybe you’ll be back.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, I’m open-minded that something could change. Kind of like we said earlier, I don’t want to use “never.”

Loren Feldman:
Is anybody still trying to talk you into it?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Not really, no.

Loren Feldman:
They’ve accepted your decision.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
I think they know. They know that I’m not someone who just is gonna willy-nilly be like, “I’m not doing this.” They know it’s been a very thoughtfully timed decision that I’ve made.

Jay Goltz:
But even still, as the parent, you don’t want to talk your kid into doing this. I mean, you don’t want to be talking your kid into doing something like this, because they said they don’t want to do it. I mean, I think that’s difficult as a parent sometimes to accept, but you have to accept that. The last thing you want to do is put them into a situation they don’t want to be in. And I’m sure on some level, your parents are happy that you made your own decision and you’re doing what you want to do. I think. Maybe I’ll call them later and see how they really feel. [Laughter]

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Okay. They’ll give you the real, real.

Loren Feldman:
Alternatively, you could move to Chicago, BaLeigh, and solve your problems and Jay’s problems.

Jay Goltz:
Maybe I’ll send you a frozen deep-dish pizza just as a taster, so you’ll know it’s here. Have you been to Chicago?

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Only once.

Jay Goltz:
Okay, maybe I’ll have to do a PR blitz and dispel some of the rumors. It’s not the Windy City —it’s not windier than anywhere else. Now, you say it rains a lot. Well, you’re in the desert there, so okay, I guess anything sounds like a lot of rain. So it doesn’t rain that much. All right, I’ll put together a PR package and we’ll send it off to you. [Laughter]

BaLeigh Waldrop:
I would be thrilled to get a deep-dish pizza in the mail from you. That would make not my day, like, my week.

Jay Goltz:
Wow. Okay.

Loren Feldman:
You’re on, Jay. BaLeigh, thank you for doing this. Tell your family, they all have the right to equal time. And if anybody’s interested, they know where to find me. BaLeigh, seriously, thank you for doing this. It’s been great for us. I hope it’s been helpful to you as well.

BaLeigh Waldrop:
Yeah, so helpful. I think doing the original podcast [episode] was definitely a step in the journey to get to the decision. So, I’m really grateful for everyone who sat in there and gave me advice and time, because it truly was part of the process.

Loren Feldman:
All right. Thanks, Jay. Thanks, BaLeigh.