Latest podcast episodes
Episode 98: Somebody’s Hiring All of These People
Somebody’s Hiring All of These People

This week, in episode 98, Jay Goltz tells Liz Picarazzi and Laura Zander that he’s had a revelation about The Great Resignation. Yes, he’s lost some people, but not necessarily his best people. “It shook the tree out,” he says, which is why he thinks businesses should be careful right now about hiring too quickly. Meanwhile, Liz talks about her latest product, a bear-proof trash enclosure, and why introducing it has been challenging. And Laura tells us what happened with the salesman she tried to send around the country in a souped-up van. Plus: Is this a great time or a terrible time to be in business?

We Don’t Have a Brand
TIME TO LISTEN: 1:05:19

This week, in episode 97, Paul Downs talks about why furniture makers traditionally have not stamped their names prominently on their work—and why he’s rethinking that now. That change of heart is the direct result of Paul’s unlikely experience connecting two very different businesses: One a Mennonite company manned by master craftsmen, and the other a startup manned by tattooed hipsters with a mastery of Kickstarter. Not only has the resulting culture clash changed the way Paul thinks about his own business, it’s also the subject of a book he’s writing. In this conversation, Paul explains what he’s up to and also talks about how close his business came to failing, how he plans to double his revenue, why he’s thinking about trying TikTok, and how he feels about his son’s success in the alternative reality of venture-backed startups.

Why Not Become the Strategic Buyer?
TIME TO LISTEN: 44:42

This week, in episode 96, Shawn Busse, Karen Clark Cole, and Jay Goltz compare notes on some of the many choices they’ve made building their businesses, such as the emphasis they’ve placed on growth, the risks they see in growing through acquisition, and—as Karen has recently experienced—the rewards of being acquired. They also discuss whether The Great Resignation, despite forcing companies to pay higher wages and work harder to find and keep talent, just might be a good thing for business owners. As Shawn says, “This puts more people into the marketplace looking for businesses where culture matters, where the owner has compassion and empathy, where families are valued, just on and on and on. And if you're that employer, you win.”

Have You Considered Not Taking Investors?

This week, in episode 95, Jay Goltz, Liz Picarazzi, and Dana White talk about the advantages and disadvantages of bringing in outside capital and expertise—something both Liz and Dana have considered. “I have a background in Russian literature and credit card marketing,” says Liz. “I'm now a manufacturer, so if I could have an outside investor who either brought that to the table or could help me with it, that would be really valuable.” But of course, there are trade-offs. We also talk about Dana’s looming franchise sales, why it’s so hard to hire lawyers and accountants, and whether there’s an opportunity for Jay in framing NFT art.

The Game Has to End at Some Point
TIME TO LISTEN: 53:38

This week, in episode 94, Shawn Busse, Paul Downs, and Jay Goltz talk about their evolving succession plans. There are lots of options—selling the business, turning it over to a family member, selling it to an employee stock ownership plan, holding a going-out-of-business sale, just walking away—and they all come with advantages and disadvantages. Shawn, Paul, and Jay take us through their current thinking and also tell us whether their businesses are prepared for the possibility that they could be incapacitated. Plus: Would any of them consider instituting a four-day work week? And we can report that this podcast now has its first B Corp. Who knows what a B Corp is?

Never miss a 21 Hats Podcast episode
The Hardest Thing I’ve Done in Business
TIME TO LISTEN: 44:40

This week, in episode 93, Jay Goltz, Liz Picarazzi, and William Vanderbloemen talk about sales, specifically the transition most founders have to make from handling sales themselves to building a sales team. Jay, Liz, and William also discuss the value of going to trade shows, the pros and cons of compensating salespeople based on commission, and the differences between inside sales and outside sales. “The kind of person,” Jay says, “who can go out there and cold call all day long and get the door slammed in their face—it's very hard to find, very hard to keep, very hard to train, very hard to control. And that’s been my biggest challenge in business, without any doubt.”

I Want to Double Sales This Year
TIME TO LISTEN: 44:07

This week, in episode 92, we introduce another new member of the 21 Hats Podcast team, Liz Picarazzi, who talks Shawn Busse and Paul Downs through a series of challenges she’s faced at her business, Citibin. Among those challenges: why she outsourced her manufacturing to China, why she’s trying to bring it back, why she’s struggling to find an American fabricator that wants her business, why she thinks she wasted all of the money she spent last year on digital marketing, how she managed to double sales anyway, and where she found the right person to handle the aspects of running Citibin that she doesn’t think she’s good at.

Maybe It’s Not the Marketing
TIME TO LISTEN: 43:56

This week, in episode 91, we introduce a new member of the 21 Hats Podcast team, Shawn Busse, who tells Jay Goltz and Laura Zander about an intriguing challenge he faces. Twenty-two years ago, Shawn co-founded a marketing firm called Kinesis, but now he’s trying to convince clients that it takes more than just marketing. Sometimes, it’s not enough just to drive more leads. Sometimes, you have to step back and take a deeper look at your business, which not every client is ready to do. In fact, it took Shawn 10 years (and the Great Recession) to do it with his own business.

Bonus Episode: Who’s Running the Business?
TIME TO LISTEN: 47:33

This week, in a special bonus episode, we talk to Steve Krull and Dan Golden, co-founders of Be Found Online, a digital marketing agency based in Chicago. In the second quarter of 2020, as COVID hit and their clients stopped advertising, Krull and Golden watched helplessly as their agency lost 40 percent of its revenue. And then things got much worse: By the end of the year, both of their wives would be diagnosed with cancer. This is a conversation about how Krull and Golden have coped with matters big and small, personal and professional, throughout an experience they compare to being in a knife fight in the middle of a forest fire.

When Fred Warmbier Wanted to Quit, Deming Brought Him Back
TIME TO LISTEN: 54:02

This week, in episode 90, we have a special guest, Fred Warmbier, owner of a metal-finishing business he founded in Cincinnati in 1998. About 10 years ago, Warmbier was ready to walk away from that business. “It just never seemed like I could have the type of business that I wanted,” he says, “where things worked properly and our employees were happy and our customers were happy.”

That changed when he discovered the Deming Management Method through a consultant, Kelly Allan, who helped him tame the chaos. Where does one start with Deming? “You start,” says Allan, who is chairman of the Advisory Council of The W. Edwards Deming Institute, “where the pain is.” As it happens, and as he discusses in this conversation, Fred Warmbier has experienced more than his share of pain.

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